Auction house- pay to use


Player avatar

OxiClean Send PM

subscriber

Posts: 220

Gp Introduction
High alching (resource(s) for gold)
Selling to stores (resource(s) for gold)
Thieving (Nothing for gold)

Resources gathered by a player are introduced at no gold cost. So this translates to:
High alching (nothing for gold)
Selling to stores (nothing for gold)
Thieving (Nothing for gold)

Then once the resources enter the player economy their worth is in gp, the medium by which all items are understood as having some exchange value with one another. So your resources vs. gp distinction is unclear to me once there is a player demand for the resource.


=========
Billy Mays' Quest Reviews[img]http://i.imgur.com/VD3epZ6.png[/img]

Player avatar

Cub Send PM

subscriber

Posts: 292

Oxy said:

Gp Introduction
High alching (resource(s) for gold)
Selling to stores (resource(s) for gold)
Thieving (Nothing for gold)

Resources gathered by a player are introduced at no gold cost. So this translates to:
High alching (nothing for gold)
Selling to stores (nothing for gold)
Thieving (Nothing for gold)

Then once the resources enter the player economy their worth is in gp, the medium by which all items are understood as having some exchange value with one another. So your resources vs. gp distinction is unclear to me once there is a player demand for the resource.

You're forgetting that people are not going to sell their items to the stores and you're forgetting that people won't be high alching their entire resources when the market value is higher.

You cannot deny that there is currently more resource value than there is gold, especially factoring in rares. As long there is more resource value than there is gold, you will have a contra gold sink.

You yourself have admitted that an resource has a gp value...but that gp value is only what it alchs for or gets sold to store for.
Only thieving introduces pure gold, where the other two options either will A) introduce pure gold in the form that the resource gets consumed by high alching or being sold to a npc store. B) gets sold to a player for market value in which increases the gold vs resource gap due to no gold was introduced to match that items market value.

I don't even know why we're even debating about rs economics when we know at the end of the day there is not going to be a tax on the auction house.

Last edited by Cub (18 Apr 2016 02:55)

Player avatar

KizL Send PM

betasubscriber

From: Seattle
Posts: 4,654

How about a gold sink for pking. By this i mean.


You can spend gold on pk coins that can be used to buy special pk gear maybe?

Cape of heal ( heals you +5 every 30 secs)
Cape of protect from mage ( blocks mage 1 out of 4)
Cape of strength ( you hit +1 higher)
Cape of pray ( prayer doesn't drain as fast)

That's a reason to wear capes in wild now and they only work in wild during pvp combat. Not while afk training or anything like that.


~K!zL


IGN: Alerion, No Mercy, Attila and KizL
[img]http://i.imgur.com/fkgmebI.png[/img]
UP and Subscribe to RSCRevolution on Reddit!
----> RSCRevolution's Reddit ----> RSCRevolution Facebook

Player avatar

Kleio Send PM

modDMM2_Participant

Posts: 691

I personally would like to see about 10 percent tax on sold items in AH. This would control the merchanting a little bit and would be a good gp sink.

Player avatar

r u t h less Send PM

Member

Posts: 277

Skilling is so easy..Everything is made easy to bring coins into game..

Skilling...High alching the items..More gold
--
Hats on here are going to be the same price they are on turnip..


B u b b a

Player avatar

Cub Send PM

subscriber

Posts: 292

beatdown said:

Gold pieces essentially never leave the economy without actual gold sinks, they just change hands and continue piling up as more is constantly added here in this kind of a system.
Resources on the other hand are regularly consumed and disappear from the game, depending on the need/demand for these resources, many of them bought and sold with those same GP + all the new GP that are constantly added, and so on, and so on. And this pile of GP will keep growing totally unrelated to the cycle of resources consumption and whether or not if that goes up, down or stays more or less the same, it doesn't matter.

Now, If resources are not consumed quickly enough, compared to the rate at which they are produced, this can cause a drop in value of said resources (or the other way around) -Supply and demand.
This is a seperate "issue" to GP inflation.
You seem to be confusing the different mechanisms here, but it's late and it's honestly hard to even know what you're talking about at this point.

And these hats and rares that you keep mentioning, are also a completely seperate thing from the actual issue at hand.
Just adding more GP changes nothing in terms of these items' value or anyone's ability to purchase these.

Imagine going from 3,5billion total GP, to for example 5Billion total GP inside the game, this also will have no direct relation on anyones actual buying power when it comes to these items, since the number of these rares is finite, and as long as new players join the game and what not, demand for them can only go up, increasing their value over time (Assuming that everyone doesn't suddenly decide to no longer want these items)
So if you simply add more GP to everyone's pockets (which is what we do every day), the prices of the hats will simply adjust accordingly. Their actual value will remain largely unchained in relation to gold pieces, the only difference will be the amount of gold pieces you pay for them.

Whether there's 2Billion GP available or 20Billion available makes no real difference on the actual value of these items. In the first scenario a Hat is simply priced at 50million and the other 500million gold pieces, but the 50million in the first scenario is worth the same as the 500million in the other, just to give you the rough idea here.

It's a similar situation to the pre-2005 Turkish Lira, where everyone were walking around with millions of Lira in their pockets.
Woah! millions of moneys for everyone?! But ofcourse, it didn't actually mean they were any richer than before the inflation, when all it meant was that a loaf of bread was 50k Lira now instead of 5. You see?

Piling up more GP doesn't change anything in terms of the relationship between GP and Items in terms of actual value and the actual buying power of the players, when it comes to trading with other players -it does however come with various negative side effects that are worth avoiding

All adding more new GP really does, is reduce the value of every other GP already in existence, while also skewing the pre-set shops prices, the value of skills like high alching and Thieving, and just generally exceeding design specifications and intentions.
And let's not forget, when was the last time you bothered picking up gold from under a mob you had just killed that wasn't a KBD? Soon the KBD drops won't be worth the right-click either. (already isn't for many, and i don't just mean the Rothschilds of this game, but just regular players)
And this will only get worse over time, much worse, so we may aswell put in place some automated system now that keeps the economy healthy, and won't require continually having to manually adjust the drop rates and all the mobs in the game, the return on skills, the shops prices, etc, and since the Auction House does provide a valuable service, it seems only fitting to place the solution here, at the center of trade. (Gee, like every other game does)

I think we should be all thankful that you don't teach economics irl. LOL'd

silly girl, we need to worry about gold sinks when there's more gold in the game than resources. At the moment there is more item resources that tie up gold, so therefor we don't need gold sinks.

Also there is a gold sink of purchasing the right half of the dragon shield from legends, thats 750k.

Last edited by Cub (18 Apr 2016 15:37)

Player avatar

scornedmagi Send PM

subscriber

From: Arizona, USA
Posts: 627

Cub, the point is to make money disappear and increase the worth of gp. A mere 750k on a shield every other day isn't shit.... I can make that in 1 day alching... 5-10% of all auctions, now that takes gp out fast and reliable. Would you rather a phat be 50m or 500m? The more gp the more it costs. Supply and demand.


[TRUST][HONOR][LOYALTY]
Check out my Skills I offer FREE!

Player avatar

GLeU Send PM

subscriber

Posts: 2,034

Cub said:

beatdown said:

Gold pieces essentially never leave the economy without actual gold sinks, they just change hands and continue piling up as more is constantly added here in this kind of a system.
Resources on the other hand are regularly consumed and disappear from the game, depending on the need/demand for these resources, many of them bought and sold with those same GP + all the new GP that are constantly added, and so on, and so on. And this pile of GP will keep growing totally unrelated to the cycle of resources consumption and whether or not if that goes up, down or stays more or less the same, it doesn't matter.

Now, If resources are not consumed quickly enough, compared to the rate at which they are produced, this can cause a drop in value of said resources (or the other way around) -Supply and demand.
This is a seperate "issue" to GP inflation.
You seem to be confusing the different mechanisms here, but it's late and it's honestly hard to even know what you're talking about at this point.

And these hats and rares that you keep mentioning, are also a completely seperate thing from the actual issue at hand.
Just adding more GP changes nothing in terms of these items' value or anyone's ability to purchase these.

Imagine going from 3,5billion total GP, to for example 5Billion total GP inside the game, this also will have no direct relation on anyones actual buying power when it comes to these items, since the number of these rares is finite, and as long as new players join the game and what not, demand for them can only go up, increasing their value over time (Assuming that everyone doesn't suddenly decide to no longer want these items)
So if you simply add more GP to everyone's pockets (which is what we do every day), the prices of the hats will simply adjust accordingly. Their actual value will remain largely unchained in relation to gold pieces, the only difference will be the amount of gold pieces you pay for them.

Whether there's 2Billion GP available or 20Billion available makes no real difference on the actual value of these items. In the first scenario a Hat is simply priced at 50million and the other 500million gold pieces, but the 50million in the first scenario is worth the same as the 500million in the other, just to give you the rough idea here.

It's a similar situation to the pre-2005 Turkish Lira, where everyone were walking around with millions of Lira in their pockets.
Woah! millions of moneys for everyone?! But ofcourse, it didn't actually mean they were any richer than before the inflation, when all it meant was that a loaf of bread was 50k Lira now instead of 5. You see?

Piling up more GP doesn't change anything in terms of the relationship between GP and Items in terms of actual value and the actual buying power of the players, when it comes to trading with other players -it does however come with various negative side effects that are worth avoiding

All adding more new GP really does, is reduce the value of every other GP already in existence, while also skewing the pre-set shops prices, the value of skills like high alching and Thieving, and just generally exceeding design specifications and intentions.
And let's not forget, when was the last time you bothered picking up gold from under a mob you had just killed that wasn't a KBD? Soon the KBD drops won't be worth the right-click either. (already isn't for many, and i don't just mean the Rothschilds of this game, but just regular players)
And this will only get worse over time, much worse, so we may aswell put in place some automated system now that keeps the economy healthy, and won't require continually having to manually adjust the drop rates and all the mobs in the game, the return on skills, the shops prices, etc, and since the Auction House does provide a valuable service, it seems only fitting to place the solution here, at the center of trade. (Gee, like every other game does)

I think we should be all thankful that you don't teach economics irl. LOL'd

silly girl, we need to worry about gold sinks when there's more gold in the game than resources. At the moment there is more item resources that tie up gold, so therefor we don't need gold sinks.

Also there is a gold sink of purchasing the right half of the dragon shield from legends, thats 750k.

its actually only 500k in legends guild, and it also drops from npcs.

P.S. a gold sink is something that removes gold from the game. buying/selling rares doesnt remove gold from the game, it just exchanges hands, and therefore ISNT A GOLD SINK.

P.S.2. also saying "LOL'd" and calling people names is only further making you look like an idiot. which believe me, you dont need help with.

Player avatar

KizL Send PM

betasubscriber

From: Seattle
Posts: 4,654

Beatdown is 100% right. Cub bro you make good pixels but... Sorry you don't know economics 4 shit.


~K!zL


IGN: Alerion, No Mercy, Attila and KizL
[img]http://i.imgur.com/fkgmebI.png[/img]
UP and Subscribe to RSCRevolution on Reddit!
----> RSCRevolution's Reddit ----> RSCRevolution Facebook

Player avatar

malfurion Send PM

Member

Posts: 1

You guys have been discussing gold sinks without mentioning the most obvious and powerful one: getting xp for skills.

There are 2 categories: Consumables and Non-consumables

Make arrows (time cost or gp cost) -> shoot arrows (trade gp value of arrows into xp)
-> make 100000000 arrows and their value goes down. Shoot that many, their value goes up.

Make rune plate mail (time cost or gp cost) -> wear for a long time
-> this will remain stable.

Consumables are a huge gold sink, since, in many cases, they allow you to exchange your gp for time spent getting it. Their prices are much more volatile, but reflect perfectly on supply and demand forces.
Non-consumables that are crafted aren't generally a good money making investment (of time), because the need is low in comparison. You can make faster cash selling vials, rather than making rune pl8s.

At the end of the day, we'd have to differentiate between "gold sink" and "redistribution of wealth". There are elements of both, but it's nuanced. Also, rscrevolution isn't like the frustrating time-gate games; it's the epitome of individual achievement based on effort, basically a meritocracy. We can't stop people from working hard at achieving, accumulating goods/gp/skills. Ultimately, it costs you the unrenwable resource of time.

I am in favour of a 5% tax (of and after a sale), with a small flat-fee (200gp) to post something up. Isn't that what World of Warcraft does?

Player avatar

Ghasp Send PM

subscriber

From: Rock
Posts: 561

We have these gold sinks called shops... if we make them more useful more gold leaves the game.... wowzers  magic


Ribbit. Ribbit. CROAK.